One Straight Shooter: Robert Haines

By Alston Ramsay | Monday, November 17, 2003

The New Hampshire primary is known for its personal politics; stories abound of face-to-face encounters with candidates in rural hamlets, and, certainly, Dartmouth has become a compulsory stop for every candidate. Republican candidate Robert Haines is no exception.

Mr. Haines showed up in Hanover earlier this week—sporting an unusual outfit: part priest, part cowboy—to pursue his bid for President. Haines is a perennial candidate: He ran in 1992 and 1996, and he has campaigned in over thirty-six states. He is even a bit of a celebrity; in 1994, during his '96 bid, he tackled a gunman who opened fire on the White House, earning him praise from the Secret Service, and a front-page article in the Washington Times.

Mr. Haines's time in Hanover was not without turmoil. He was served a letter informing him that he was not welcome on Dartmouth's campus, the Daily D published an openly hostile article, Murphy's kicked him out, and, to top off matters, someone stole his American flag. Still, Mr. Haines continued his underdog bid for the White House, quoting the Gospel and exulting his credentials to anyone who would listen. He has served as an administrator at the Texas Military Institute, an energy consultant, a real estate broker, and an operating engineer. He has numerous degress, and, more recently, he was an independent scholar on Capitol Hill. Mr. Haines was the very first candidate to submit his papers for the New Hampshire primaries.

The Dartmouth Review recently caught up with Mr. Haines as he spread his Word on the corner of Main Street and Wheelock.

The Dartmouth Review: You ran for President in '92 and '96. What prompted you to run the first time?

Robert Haines: I care deeply about the country. I care deeply about Americans, and that's one of the reasons that I ran for the Presidency. In 1989 I read the book Inside Job. It's about the greatest financial scandal in world history where our government leaders changed the laws to allow access to the savings and loan funds, and they stole the money from the senior citizens. That really got me going because it was the people in Washington, D.C. who passed the laws to allow that to happen. It was an Inside job with a capital "I."

TDR: What do you think is different about this election cycle that gives you a better chance?

RH: I'm more experienced. I mean, I've campaigned in thirty-six states, so I'm an experienced campaigner. I have a much better chance. I hope that answers your question.

TDR: Do you think you offer conservatives something President Bush doesn't?

RH: Yes: Conservatism. That's what I offer them, because he doesn't offer that.

TDR: You're potentially running against two fundraising juggernauts with President Bush first, and, if you beat him, potentially Howard Dean, who has been raising quite a bit of money. How are you planning to compete with the sheer dollars involved in this campaign?

RH: I imagine with sheer truth and determination. Courage, truth, determination, and will will beat big money anytime. I'll beat 'em just with raw guts!

TDR: Changing subjects a little, you got some rather unfavorable coverage in the Daily D this morning. What do you think?

RH: Well, let's take a look here. It says that I was spotted at the football game. I was not at the game; I was actually outside the stadium on the sidewalk at the gate, which I considered public property. So when it says "Haines subsequently left the campus property" I didn't think I was on the campus property to begin with, because I was on the sidewalk outside the stadium. I thought that was public property. So I think that's wrong on page one. My flag was stolen at 11 A.M.

TDR: Wait. Who stole your flag?

RH: I was flying the flag upside down. In fact, I picketed the St. Thomas Episcopal Church prior to the 10 A.M. service flying the flag upside down

TDR: Why would you fly the flag upside down?

RH: Because they got it wrong; they're supporting the gay Bishop.

TDR: Gotcha. Why would you fly it upside here on the corner of Main Street?

RH: That was Sunday morning, and I'm trying to address the moral dilemma facing our nation and our churches. There's something very distressing, okay? Our country is in distress. It is not a false sign. That church, I can see it from here, is in distress. I was sending a strong message, okay? So I came over here around 10 A.M. and I went in, and I was talking to the Associated Press, and someone took the flag.

TDR: You were talking about a moral dilemma. Is that why you're wearing this outfit?

RH: Yes. This is a strong message that I am addressing the moral issues affecting the nation and our churches.

TDR: What are some of these moral issues?

RH: Well the infiltration of the Church's body by the Dark Side okay? This is not by coincidence that all these things are happening. This is a deliberate attempt by the Dark Side to infiltrate the church. [They're] organizing a deliberate attempt for them to take over churches and to take over seminaries, and use children and so on and so forth. This is not a coincidental thing; it's an organized thing, an organized cover-up, etc., etc. It's all organized.
TDR: What is the "Dark Side"?

RH: People working for Satan himself. Yes, the Dark Side, they are working for Satan. These people are not worshipping God, the most High, the most Almighty, or Jesus Christ. They are doing the work of the Devil—Satan himself.

TDR: And that is something you're definitely going to change?

RH: I'm changing it right now by my activities here. I am offering the community the Word of God and I am saying, by holding this Bible and holding a piece of bread in my left hand, I am offering the bread of life, the body of Christ, the bread in my left hand, and the world's best selling Book, at this Ivy League school in New Hampshire, saying "Here, take and eat the Body of Christ. Take and read the Word of God, the world's all-time best-selling Book." This is a university. I am offering this Book to you. I am offering this opportunity for you to consider to read this Book, the world's all-time best-seller. Okay?

TDR: Tell us about your flag campaign.

RH: The flag campaign originated here. The flag was stolen at 11 A.M. on Sunday morning when people are in church and everything else. I was flying the flag upside down here in front of the Hanover Inn, and I was on the phone to the Associated Press at the time of the theft. So when I came outside, I said, "My flag's been stolen" to a couple of people. "I'm going to start a fund to replace the flag, would you like to make a contribution?" and people started giving me contributions, because I was really going to go out and buy another flag and put it on here. And then I thought to myself, "You know, that's not a big enough statement, to just buy another flag. This flag is right here; we're at Dartmouth, and we're in Hanover, and we really have to make a statement." There's not many things that are lower than stealing an American flag on a Sunday morning from a Presidential candidate. That's pretty low. That is "Bad" with a capital "B." So I said, "We're going to make a statement out of this and we're going to get a bigger flag." I figured we'll really do it up right. We're going to get a flag big enough to cover up the entire wall of the Hanover Inn facing the campus Green. Okay?

TDR: That's a big flag.

RH: That's a big flag and we can do it! Easily raise that money. And while we're doing it we're going to raise enough money to beat Bush and Dean at their own game. Big D [Dartmouth] is going to D.C. with me! And I got people chanting that here: Big D is going to D.C. with me! You got it?

TDR: Oh, I got it. Let's discuss some specific issues. Where do you stand on, say, gun control?

RH: Use both hands.

TDR: Social security reform?

RH: Has to be modernized to use for future generations.

TDR: Taxes?

RH: All pay their fair share. Reduce big government, and really reduce it big time.

TDR: Now, paying your fair share: Would that be a flat income tax, or something along those lines, or what exactly?

RH: I haven't gotten into the specific details. Let me just say this: It would be very difficult to unravel the tax code. People have been getting tax breaks, tax loopholes, special treatment for hundreds of years through Congress. People have spent a considerable amount of time, money, everything else to get these laws passed so that the tax structure is the way it is. It would be very difficult to undo what is done, but I think you need to simplify it.

TDR: Welfare?

RH: I think able-bodied people should work, but when a person is out of work you have to help them. They have a family, a home, they have to have unemployment benefits and things to take care of them until they get back and support themselves. But able-bodied people should work. But, let's get into the immigration issue. We have to. Let me just call it what it is: It's an invasion, not immigration. You got an actual invasion into the country. Thirteen million illegal immigrants, and you got nine million unemployed Americans. I'll enforce the immigration laws that are on the books and create millions of jobs! How's that? If a woman is pregnant and the child is born here, then the child gets social security benefits, hospital benefits, medicare, whatever, here, because the child is born here. So they deliberately come here when they're pregnant so their child can be born here and get all those benefits.

TDR: Race-based affirmative action?

RH: I'm not in favor of affirmative action.

TDR: Foreign policy? What is the United States' role in world affairs?

RH: Our foreign policy is being controlled by a lack of a plan for energy independence, okay? I will declare energy independence, an actual "Declaration of Energy Independence" so that our foreign policies and our military policies are not dependent or tied to our lack of an energy independence policy. On defense and foreign policy, we need peace through strength. We need to protect America and our strategic and security interests, a strong tactical military, we need to reduce our global deployments and commitments, transition to regional disengagements, sell weapons to our allies for their own self-defense, world-wide chemical, nuclear, and biological disarmament, re-employ veterans as a silent force in an all-out, covert war on terrorism and drugs at their sources, impose export controls on weapons, and continue research on the Strategic Defense Initiative. Now this is all tied to my energy and environment policy. We need to plan for a "Declaration of Energy Independence," which will change our defense and foreign policies, including education, exploration, conservation, fuel economy, renewables and research at the national renewable laboratory. Satellite and global positioning research in combination with the SDI, an enlargement of the strategic petroleum reserve. All of this will reduce pollution and provide clean air and clean water. We need more mass transit systems that are high speed if they are economically viable and we need to research supersonic transportation, particularly with sub-orbital flights. We need to upgrade our current vehicle fleet with the latest technology, and we need to enforce our environmental laws.

TDR: Abortion?

RH: Aren't you glad your mom didn't kill you?

TDR: In some respects, people consider you a hero. In 1994 when you were running against Bill Clinton, you actually stopped an attempted assassination attempt against him. Why would you risk your life to save your opponent?

RH: Well, I would do it for you. If somebody opened fire right now, I'd go after them in a heartbeat. Okay? It's instinctive. But I'll also give you a quote from the Bible. It goes something like this: "No greater love hath a man, than to lay down his life for his fellow man." Okay? So, I care.

TDR: Were you scared when you tackled the gunman?
RH: No. It's just instinctive. Instinct and no fear whatsoever. And I wasn't wearing my protective vest that day, okay?

TDR: Speaking of protective vests, in the campaign literature, there's something about a conviction...

RH: Yes.

TDR: Can you elaborate on that?

RH: In my campaign literature it doesn't say anything about a conviction, but it says I was charged in 1995. It's an assault/defense case that's been appealed to the U.S. Court of Appeals, and, yes, I do address that in my campaign literature because I want to be right upfront with people. This case could go to the Supreme Court of the United States and it likely may, and it's an interesting case—it involves self-defense of my self and my wife while campaigning for the Presidency. It happened in New Hampshire, and let me just say that there's been a federal attorney who has been appointed on my behalf who went to school at Phillips Andover Academy with George Walker Bush, and he doesn't like George Walker Bush. He's my federal defender on this case, a very interesting case, and look for it to go to the Supreme Court.

TDR: What were you charged with?

RH: I was charged with reckless conduct and wearing a protective vest.

AR: Doesn't a Presidential candidate have the right to defend himself and also wear a vest if he thinks that his life's threatened?

RH: Yes, resoundingly yes. People have the right to self defense and Presidential candidates have the right to wear protective vests to protect themselves. Yes, they do.

TDR: This was shortly after the assasination attempt on Clinton?

RH: It was, but I had been wearing a protective vest prior to that because my life had been threatened back around 1990, and I had worn a protective vest then. I wore the vest for the '92 campaign for Presidency, and I wore it through '92. I was then in California for the Rodney King revolts, and I hired a bodyguard, and the bodyguard had been shot seven times in Vietnam and had the Purple Heart. He grabbed the man, the man's arm, and prevented the man from shooting me with a .357 magnum. Then, as I told you, this man who was successfully prosecuted for attempted assassination of President Clinton and shooting at four secret service agents, $3,200 worth of damage to the White House, including bullet holes through the West Wing press room. He fired ten bullets in the direction of the White House, but then he turned and pointed that rifle directly at me and looked me straight in the eyes. Two weeks after the White House shooting incident I was brutally beaten in front of the Lincoln memorial while campaigning. I sustained four fractures and fourteen-thousand dollars worth of surgery. And that's one of the reasons I defended myself in 1995 in Manchester with my wife.

TDR: It's sounds like a pretty dangerous profession. Do you think it's worth it?

RH: Of course it's worth it. Also in January of 1995, someone kicked me and threatened to kill me in front of the Mayor's office around noon in Manchester. Yes, it is dangerous because right now, someone may not like the way I'm dressed and come up and try to kill me, or shoot me, or hurt me, just maybe because...for any reason. Somebody can be drunk, on drugs, or may not like your political stance. They don't like something you're doing. In Wyoming, for example, a person wanted me to legalize marijuana; he wanted to know where I stand on legalization of marijuana. Well, I told him I wasn't in favor of it. The guy beat me with a broom handle, for crying out loud. It's a dangerous business. I'm out here in the street, and I don't have a bodyguard, but I can defend myself. You know what I mean? Most people will travel with a lot of men around them, protected, in a limo, from hotel to motel, slipping in and out, and you don't have to deal with the general public. I'm a man of the people, by the people, and for the people. I fear no one. I fear God and God only. I can protect myself out here.

TDR: A lot of people would say that you don't have a chance in this campaign. How would you respond to your critics?

RH: They don't know what they're talking about. I'm going to win. I'm going to win. I'm unstoppable. I'm absolutely unstoppable!

TDR: One final question: Do you think you're living the American Dream?

RH: I have lived the American Dream. Listen, I am baseball, apple pie, and Chevrolet. When I was your age, I was a college student. Do you realize I bought a Corvette for cash with my own money? Nineteen years old, I drove a 1958 Corvette in 1967. I have lived the American Dream, sir. I built a model solar home in the Rocky Mountains, at 8,200 feet in elevation. I used to ride horseback around my home in trails with 14,000 foot snow-capped peaks around me. I am the American Dream, sir. I have lived it, and I am it. It's in my book, America: Land of the Free, Home of the Brave. Am I living the American Dream? Yes. I am living it, and I am it.

TDR: Hopefully, you're going to take that to the White House?

RH: Yes, sir, with your help and Big D's help! Big D is going to D.C. with me!

TDR: Thank you, Mr. Haines.

One Straight Shooter: Robert Haines

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